Lore talk:The Song of Pelinal

Noincludes

On volumes 2-6, the "Editor's Note" is noinclude'd. I understand that it's so it won't be shown 6 times when it's transcluded onto "Lore:The Song of Pelinal" or "Oblivion:Song of Pelinal", but what about when they're transcluded onto the individual Oblivion pages for each volume? Shouldn't this note be shown there? --GuildKnight^Talk2me 22:48, 28 October 2008 (EDT)

Vol 1: On His Name

I was wondering if anyone knows anything about this? Pelinal Whitestrake is not his actual name but an alias or nickname given to him? Im guessing he is called or perhapes referred to as "Pelinal" by the slave rebellion due to his actions for their cause. Or maybe he changed his own name when he began fighting the Alyeids? This leads me to my second question. Is the author referring to his white hair as being literal or as an allegory for his seriousness? If actually white then this obviously influences "Whitestrake" as being part of his name as well. But the text says it's derived from the "killing light" from his left hand. I'm guessing the light is some type of spell he uses and that he is a southpaw. Could there also be the possibility of his name being changed throughout the years like Alessia? (Gadianzero 03:48, 2 January 2009 (EST))

Although the text states that it is not known where the name comes from, it answers that question in a separate section, which just goes to show how fragmentary and disjointed it it. Pelinal comes from Pelin-El, which means Star-Made Knight. That can refer to the killing light in his left hand, if you like, or just a general reference to his divine nature, of having come from the gods. Vivec described the Numidium as a walking star. Coincidentally, or perhaps for some unknown reason, the Wild Elf (Ayleid nomads who survived in hiding until the modern era) word for 'stranger' is 'Pellani.' The sources seem very confused about his name, but I think it stayed reasonably constant. Where Alessia collected names, Pelinal seems to have accumulated titles.

I don't see any reason why his hair color should be allegory. But when they say his left hand was made of killing light, it is perhaps best to interpret it as exactly that- some sort of divine cyborg blowtorch. The important thing is that this guy is not even slightly human. There was a forum thread where the author of the KotN texts invited people to write short, impromptu fan fiction with the purpose of chucking around ideas and exploring his image of the character. Pelinal emerged even more alien from that, lol.Temple-Zero 10:53, 2 January 2009 (EST)

Origins

Did he really just stumble out of the jungle covered in blood and join Alessia's army? I understand that he is divine in some way but I do not see him as a supernatural being, his Lore page describes him as being an avatar of Shor but all the info on UESP for Shezarr, Morihaus, Kynareth, and the book Shezarr and the Divines seems to leave three possibilities:

1. He is some form of Shezarr himself.

2. He is a creation of Shezarr's possibly with or without Kynareth.

3. His divinity simply comes from an unexplained source.

He could have been born as a half man half god or his powers could have been given to him much later in life by the gods. This perhapes would help explain his fits of "madness". Such power on a mortal man can understandably have side effects, look at what happened to Martin. I believe him either being born as half or originating as a mortal is the most likely. In the vision you recieve from him in KotN he is indeed the spirit of a man and not some Divine Being.

He has all the traits and flaws of a human being. Pride, Courage, Wrath, Anger, Hate, Love. He exhibits all of these things even as he is dying (Adabal-a). Despite being the catalyst for the slave arrmy to overthrow the Aylied capital he is upset at his failure to defeat Umaril. When speaking to him in the vision he sorriful because of it (I'll have to check again on that). To me at least this is why I think he is at least partially if not mostly a mortal man. (Gadianzero 13:05, 3 January 2009 (EST))

You missed one. Read Vol. 2: On His Coming. Kyne gave St. Alessia a red jewel that turned into a man like a hologram image. As for what he is, you are using the labels man and divine like they are mutually exclusive. He is, in one way, an avatar of Shezarr (or Shor or Lorkhan). These avatars have appeared throughout history (King Wulfharth, for one) and they have also been men with the full range of pride, courage, hate etc. In short they are characters like any other in the story, yet they are still divine, like Greek gods and goddesses walking the earth in various guises.

So Pelinal is an avatar of Shezarr (I think the word Shezarrine crops up every now and then, related to the word Nerevarine), but that's not all. Why is he mad? Why do some stories say it was Akatosh that gave Alessia the Amulet of Kings and some say it was Shezarr? Because they are related, one and the same, though opposites. Pelinal is a two sided coin, the embodiment of two mutually antagonistic deities who are forcibly joined at the hip. It's a little known fact, but Akatosh is insane. Pelinal, as Shezarr is the spirit behind human undertaking and the champion of man. He is also the bloodthirsty scourge of elves, as Shor is known to be. From time to time the other side of his divided character takes over because he is at war with himself. Then he goes on mad rampages and destroys the very landscape so that even the maps deny that it ever existed.

To sum up, he is a divine being with divine origins. He is the son of Akatosh, and he travelled back from a different time to aid Alessia. He shouted the name of Reman hundreds of years before his birth. He showed up millenia later to talk to a knight and couldn't remember if he had killed Umaril yet or not. Didn't know what the date was. But none of this doesn't mean that he can't appear human, and really be an identifiable character. Some of the time he is more natural than he Nerevarine, who is immortal and immune to disease. In high fantasy, it is possible for the fantastic to occurr in a natural way. It is a troubling trend that everyone wants some explanation for every mystical event, as if magic is just intruding like a squatter upon an otherwise mundane world.Temple-Zero 15:24, 3 January 2009 (EST)