User talk:PLRDLF

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Welcome PLRDLF[edit]

Hello! Welcome to the wiki. I hope you enjoy using the site and find the information on it useful. If you decide you want to help improve any of our pages, we're always welcoming to new editors so feel free. Thanks for uploading DF images and icons. If you need any help or advice, please ask one of our mentors. Enjoy! --BenouldTC 20:26, 13 June 2008 (EDT)

Tamriel:People[edit]

Yeah, I've been trying to keep it as one image per entry (preference to the most recent one) so it doesn't get to cluttered. I mean, we can discuss this more on one of the talk pages if you want, but I just wanted you to know the policy I've been going with. --Ratwar 01:24, 14 June 2008 (EDT)

Time for a treat[edit]

Choco chip cookie.png
You have been given a cookie!

Your dedication and diligence to the wiki has not gone unnoticed. A user has seen the progress you've made, and has given you a cookie because of it. Good work! The user had the following to say:

I think your work in the Daggerfall namespace has been incredible. Possibly the fastest pick-up on how to help the wiki I've seen so far! I hope you choose to stay even longer, as help will always be appreciated. Thanks again, - Game LordTalk

Spellings[edit]

First, thank you for all the work you're putting into the Daggerfall pages! It's great to see another active editor in that area. However, the site prefers in-game spellings and, where different versions exist, the American one takes precedence - largely because the server is based in Canada. That's why I just changed your "worshippers" back to "worshiper". I used to find it frustrating but you get used to it over time! –RpehTCE 07:14, 16 June 2008 (EDT)

Kain or Khane?[edit]

Is Baron Shrike's brother Lord Kain or Lord Khane? I noticed you recently changed the entry on Daggerfall:People to Khane, but other pages still say Kain. Also, the Tamriel:Host of the Horn page makes the link between Lord Kain in Daggerfall and the undead Lord Kain encountered in Battlehorn Castle. --Gaebrial 03:08, 17 July 2008 (EDT)

Having read the journals present in Battlehorn Castle, I don't think there's any question that Lord Khane from Daggerfall and Lord Kain from Oblivion are the same person. The only question is what is his correct name? Personally, I'd go with Lord Kain, as this is the most recent spelling of his name, and mention the alternative spelling in Daggerfall as a note to the text. Probably best to set Lord Khane up as a redirect, as well. --Gaebrial 02:42, 18 July 2008 (EDT)

Cookie![edit]

Choco chip cookie.png
You have been given a cookie!

Your dedication and diligence to the wiki has not gone unnoticed. A user has seen the progress you've made, and has given you a cookie because of it. Good work! The user had the following to say:

Your continuing work in the Daggerfall namespace has been outstanding. Thank you! --BenouldTC 19:21, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

Naming Inconsistency?[edit]

I just noticed that we have Daggerfall:Antiphyllos for the province and Daggerfall:Antyphyllos for the city. Is that correct, or should the latter be moved to Daggerfall:Antuphyllos (city)? –RpehTCE 11:30, 10 August 2008 (EDT)

Thanks for the update. I'll let you take care of it - you obviously know what you're doing :) –RpehTCE 11:53, 10 August 2008 (EDT)

Wanna be a Patroller?[edit]

I've just nominated you for Patroller status, mainly because most of the rest of us don't know jack about Daggerfall, and it would save us from having to patrol your edits. There wouldn't be any added responsibilities in case you're worried about that. It just means that for us, all your edits would be auto-patrolled so we don't have to check them one by one. If you want to accept or decline the nomination, you can do so on the page. --TheRealLurlock Talk 14:00, 12 August 2008 (EDT)

Daggerfall mages guild quests[edit]

Hi PLRDLF,

On the Daggerfall:Quests page, I've noticed that some of the mages guild quest names are written in lower case, and some in upper case. Is this an in-game thing, or should they be changed to match the rest?

Also; the quest "A ancient scroll" should probably be "An ancient scroll", but, once again, is that an in-game grammatical error?

Thanks. - Game LordTalk|Contribs 09:37, 10 September 2008 (EDT)

Spelling Question[edit]

I just noticed that we have a lot of pages linking to Daggerfall:Armourer. Our Spelling policy would suggest that we should be linking without the "u" in "Armourer" unless the game says different. You are our current Daggerfall Guru, so what is the answer? "u" or not? I actually have the game now so will be able to give an opinion at some stage, but it seems easiest to ask you at the moment given how much work you have done! –RpehTCE 16:21, 12 September 2008 (EDT)

Are these the same?[edit]

I've just noticed that we have three different red links with very similar titles:

Daggerfall:Daggerfall (Region) has "The Royal Guard",
Daggerfall:Sentinel has "The Royal Guards", and
Daggerfall:Lord Vhosek "Royal Guards".

I'm guessing that these all refer to the same thing, but could you confirm that, and correct where necessary? Thanks. –RpehTCE 14:35, 6 October 2008 (EDT)

Looking it over, these are separate organizations, each serving the major state. --Timmeh Talk 10:34, 10 October 2008 (EDT)

Hello, my name is Tim[edit]

Hey. I've editted Daggerfall in the past and was wondering if you'd like a hand. --Timmeh Talk 10:32, 10 October 2008 (EDT)

Hey, I'm not sure how you and Uniblab are getting your information. It would be nice to know how you get all the numerical info so I can exploit it myself. --Timmeh Talk 23:09, 27 October 2008 (EDT)
Daggerfall_talk:Daggerfall_(Region) --Timmeh Talk 11:49, 28 October 2008 (EDT)
Hey, I'm just curious if you want to come into the IRC room we have. A bunch of admins and people are there. (this is the link from "Chatroom" on the side) [1]
I'm curious; is Daggerfall:The_Necromancers content copied from the Daggerfall game, or did you write that yourself, because I believe it is confirmed that Mannimarco is a lich somewhere. --Timmeh Talk 09:38, 3 November 2008 (EST)

Image Problems?[edit]

It looks like you hit a problem when uploading the telescope image. The wiki sets its caching settings quite strongly on images so you will probably need to hard-refresh if you upload a second copy of the same image. –RpehTCE 01:11, 17 November 2008 (EST)

Character Creation[edit]

Do you know if the change in the difficulty dagger when you make a custom class and add advantages or disadvantages is a numerical thing or something. If you have any data stashed around, would you mind letting me look at it (or tell me how to get it) so I can make a "Daggerfall:Custom_Class" page. If you find some info, email it to me (should be an "email this user" on the left hand side of this screen when your on my userpage). --Timmeh Talk 16:40, 21 November 2008 (EST)

Ok. Well if you find any values or anything send them along. Seems like a really important page that we need to make since Morrowind and Oblivion's custom character creation process is so different. --Timmeh Talk

Your Images[edit]

Hi, I don't know if you've noticed this or not, but some of the images you've uploaded (Or all of them, I'm not sure) have the header "Beschreibung" instead of "Summary". I'm not sure why this would be, but one reason I can think of is that you're using an external program to upload the images. This is itself is not a problem, so long as you make sure that it uploads them in the correct language. If you're not using an external program, and are uploading the images via the wiki page Special:Upload, then I think we'll need to contact Daveh on this one. As a temporary solution if this is the case, just correct each image after you upload it. Thanks! - Game LordTalk|Contribs 12:48, 30 November 2008 (EST)

Just a note: You should change Beschreibung to Summary, not Description. Even though Description is the direct translation, Summary is used everywhere else. You don't need to bother correct the ones you already did though, just use Summary from now on. - Game LordTalk|Contribs 10:13, 2 December 2008 (EST)

Reputation Question[edit]

I was glancing at Daggerfall:Business_with_Orcs and I noticed that the reputation if you give the item to the orc's contact is -30 to orsinium, which seems incredibly dumb since your doing them a favor. So, I'm wondering if you entered it wrong or if its in the wrong section perhaps. Merry Christmas, --Timmeh Talk 16:56, 10 December 2008 (EST)

Your Advice[edit]

If you have a minute, please could you take a look at Daggerfall:Vampirism/Archive? It's currently an orphaned page - there aren't any links to it (apart from the one I just posted) and it's not transcluded anywhere. If you look at its talk page, Nephele removed a deletion tag from the page once (quite reasonably) but nothing has happened since. Is any of the information on the page useful, accurate, needed or in any way worth keeping? It's been over 18 months since the page was last edited meaningfully, so I'd rather the content was either used or killed. Thanks for your time. –RpehTCE 14:38, 20 December 2008 (EST)

Me and Rpeh talked about this earlier about a different subject. I think we need to check with Daveh, who I believe told us some stuff from Daggerfall and Arena need to be archived, for which stuff should be archived or not. If he doesn't care, I think everything (in the Daggerfall section that I can remember) except Daggerfall:Official_WWW_FAQ, Daggerfall:Old_Unofficial_FAQ, Daggerfall:Unofficial_Daggerfall_FAQ, and Daggerfall_Unofficial_Newbie_FAQ should be deleted. I think these articles were either written by Daveh or have some sentimental value to him. --Tim Talk 19:17, 21 December 2008 (EST)

Good job[edit]

Hey, I just wanted to say you're doing a good job on the Daggerfall Quests and to keep it up. I'm also wondering if you are planning on doing something similar with the main quest? Also, do you have a Daggerfall Manual? My sandbox, Sandbox 3 is over custom classes, and from the in-game help I found it said that Advantages and Disadvantages data is in there. I really only want the descriptions, everything else is either done or going to be done. I'm trying to download a Manual, but I'm having little success. Have a Merry Christmas and good work. --Tim Talk 19:17, 21 December 2008 (EST)

A small question[edit]

Hey. Gabriel made an edit to change what I assume is taken directly from the game. However, after reading it over, it looks like either you made a mistake when you changed her to (her) and she to (she) or the developers didn't take into account proper grammar. Could you check that part please? In situations where we've copied what Bethesda has written, I prefer to keep what Bethesda has and put a "sic" over it to prevent it from being edited. --Tim Talk 10:24, 24 December 2008 (EST)

Another small question, if you have experience with the BIOG text files. Do you know what !???? means in this situation. If not, I'll probably try to email Uniblab and see if he knows.
1. What school of magic have you been
studying the longest?
a. Destruction
#4150
!4156
22 +6

Daggerfall Quest Variables[edit]

As a general information, expressions in parentheses are to be considered as Quest Variables, that are substituted by their literal meanings. When there is only one expression in the parentheses, it means the quest variable is not random, but predefined e.g. gender, item, enemy ... . Therefor expressions in parentheses should not be changed.--PLRDLF 10:58, 24 December 2008 (EST)

Except that the purpose of the quest pages (of the wiki, in general) is to document what players experience when playing the game. If the primary purpose of the articles was to document the quest variables within the text, then I'm assuming a lot of things would be done differently. For example, we'd use the exact quest variable names within the text, instead of translating the variable names into text that makes sense to readers. Or we'd at least make the human-legible text consistently match the underlying variable name: for example, in articles such as The Impostor, the text would read "(artifact's name)" instead of "(Chrysamere)".
When the text truly is variable, I agree that it makes sense to put the text in parentheses; that makes it clear to readers that the displayed text does not literally appear in game. But when the content of the parentheses is what literally appears in the game, in every possible situation, then I feel the parentheses just cause confusion for readers: why are the parentheses there? Do the parentheses appear in the game? Why is that word in parentheses and not other words? (In fact, in the above example with The Impostor, I'm even confused: is "lodestone" the text that literally appears? Or is "(lodestone)" a generic term that gets replaced by more specific words? Not using parentheses around literal text would make that much less ambiguous.) A person playing the game doesn't care that the word "her" is actually a variable in the game file: all that reader cares about is that "her" is what appears on the screen when he/she is playing the game. At which point, the text is no different from "I would give" or whatever other bits make up the displayed text. --NepheleTalk 14:43, 4 January 2009 (EST)
As an example for Daggerfall's word processing a short example, from the quest The Impostor:
You must get the daedric _ingredient_ from ___dungeon_. I don't know where that is, but I'm sure you can find it. When you have the daedric _ingredient_ bring it to _meetingplace_ here in town. There you will meet _qgiver_, and %g will give you the _artifact_
String variables e.g. %someexpression have a fixed meaning within the game e.g %g means He or She, depending on the character's gender. This and all other string variables refer to a fixed sort of expression which varies. Quest variables however e.g. _ingredient_ are entirely arbitrarily, they are only placeholders. You only know their meaning when you know their references. In this quest _ingredient_ refers to the item "lodestone". As I already mentioned numerous times, most quest objects are determined randomly e.g. the reference to "gem" for a quest item means any gem, or quest related NPCs can be male or female. You can't know how the game engine will finally handle the quest set-up.I don't know any universal solution one could use to write a quest walktrough under such vary conditions. Therefore I translated the quest variables into human-legible text and put them in parenthesis to show, they vary. I used this method when I started to contribute my quest walkthroughs and have retained this course since. I assume you will agree, a raw text as shown above is incomprehensible for anyone who has no knowledge of the game's internal processing and is therefore inadequate for any article. If you have a better idea how the in-game texts of the walkthroughs should be written. I'm amenable for suggestions.--PLRDLF 18:01, 4 January 2009 (EST)
I agree completely that translating the variable names into human-legible text makes sense. And I agree that when the text is not literally what appears in game, then it should be in parentheses to make it clear that chunk of text gets replaced. All that I was questioning (based on Timmeh's original question above) is whether text derived from variables should always be in parentheses (should the text appear as "That cursed (Daedra Seducer) (Daedra Seducer's name) put you up to this, didn't (she)?") Or, when the text derived from a variable turns out to be fixed, should the parentheses be dropped (should the text appear as "That cursed (Daedra Seducer) (Daedra Seducer's name) put you up to this, didn't she?"). I was arguing in favour of the latter: when a variable ends up having only possible value, that value should be displayed, and since it is literally what appears for all players (since it will not, in fact, vary), it should not be in parentheses. --NepheleTalk 18:37, 4 January 2009 (EST)
Well, I was about to make the same suggestion. When I started to contribute back in summer, I didn't have the insight I've now, when it comes to the internal processings of Daggerfall. I have retained the traditional style for the walkthroughs until now, to keep them consistent. When there is really only one distinct expression in parentheses it will remain always the same, despite the circumstance that is is strictly speaking a variable.--PLRDLF 19:18, 4 January 2009 (EST)

Reputation[edit]

Hey, I was wondering if you had a list of Daggerfall factions with their faction number. The wiki doesn't have a list of these (and it probably should have one, if you have it, put it under Daggerfall:BIOG??T0.TXT Files/Faction Codes). I was wondering if you had one lying around or knew where to grab one. Here is a sample question where this information would be useful (in case if your not sure what I'm talking about)

b. Arkay, Birth and Death God

rf82 +5

Daggerfall Redesign Project[edit]

Hey, I think you're getting pretty close to done with the faction quest pages and I've just got done fixing up the character creation process. Nobody has put anything on the UESPWiki:Daggerfall_Redesign_Project page in a while, and I was wondering what you think our next steps for Daggerfall are.

Also, my Vista computer won't run Daggerfall, and my other computer is on the fritz. I was wondering if you could upload an image of the Tamriel map from the daggerfall character creation process for me, because I can't find one on the website (i looked for 15 minutes :|). --Tim Talk 15:18, 25 December 2008 (EST)

Another Cookie[edit]

Choco chip cookie.png
You have been given a cookie!

Your dedication and diligence to the wiki has not gone unnoticed. A user has seen the progress you've made, and has given you a cookie because of it. Good work! The user had the following to say:

I just realised that I haven't given you a cookie yet... I think I had been about to do so when Game Lord handed his over. You definitely deserve it though: the work you've done on our DF pages has been fantastic and has taken them a long, long way closer to completion. Thank you very much, and long may it continue! –RpehTCE 14:51, 30 December 2008 (EST)

Thanks![edit]

I am... busy. Thanks for coming aboard and doing nice things for Daggerfall. I don't know when I'll be able to be "regular" again (I tried eating more fibre), but I hope to be back "full-time-ish" again soon. You have my thanks for doing the Right Thing and being Good about it. Uniblab 05:50, 12 January 2009 (EST)

Battlespire resolution[edit]

I was wondering why you found it necessary to use fullresolution=640x480 in DOSBox. Does fullresolution=original not work for your monitor?

Just try fullresolution=0 or fullresolution=1024x768 and than fullresolution=640x480, you will see the difference.--PLRDLF 19:11, 27 March 2009 (EDT)

Sorry to Hear That[edit]

Hi, I just noticed the proposed deletion tag on your user page. It's a real shame that you won't be able to contribute any more. You've done some fantastic work on the Daggerfall pages and it will be a huge blow to lose you. I hope that whatever the new circumstances are, it's nothing serious and that you'll be back again at some point to continue your work. In any case, I'd ask that you remove the tag - having a page to tell other users about the tremendous editor who has done so much is the very least you deserve. –RpehTCE 03:23, 10 May 2009 (EDT)

Actually I had hoped it wouldn't come that far, but it was a development which was on the horizon for a long time. Perhaps I will still add some more contributions to the site, but I can not guarantee how long I will be able to do so. But at the moment it is very likely that my activities in this field will come to an end very soon. Perhaps there is a way this can still be avoided or I will be able to resume my contributions one day, but at the moment I'm not able to say anything regarding this circumstances. Like the French say: C'est la vie.--PLRDLF 09:40, 12 May 2009 (EDT)

Thanks[edit]

I had intended to add on to the Dark Brotherhood stub pages when I got home from work today, to see you'd already gone ahead and got them. Thanks!  :-) Cheers, Glenmorial 19:52, 17 May 2009 (EDT)

TES: Arena stuff[edit]

Hi, PLRDLF! I'm planning to create a remake of TES: Arena in a roguelike. The remake will be as identical as possible, so i need to retrieve a huge amount of game data. But i don't know how. I only started to learn C/C++, and this knowledge will not help me to hack into Arena files. The only program concerning extracting game resources is WinArena, but i couldn't find the author. Sources are available, but WinArena lacks many functions, and if i want to implement them, i need to know, how Arena file mechanics works (what file is for what purpose etc.) Any suggestions? May be you know how to contact aouthor of WinArena or enthusiasts who may help. Or you may give some tips to hack into Arena game data or so...

While i explore Arena, i want to contribute to Arena section of UESP too. But it would be better, if i knew how to extract useful data from game resources (=. --Sindikat 09:07, 20 May 2009 (EDT)

Sorry, but I have not concerned myself much with Arena. I played it once through, but this was some years ago. I'm afraid I cannot provide much aid to you in this matter.--PLRDLF 20:29, 20 May 2009 (EDT)

Quest S0000500[edit]

You know that this quest is from the CompUSA 'addon'. However, this quest was updated in the last Daggerfall patch 2.13 (only the QBN file, the QRC one is the same). Did you use this version to make your patch? I ask this because many Daggerfall users don't know that this optional quest was updated and often extract the CompUSA quests to the ARENA2 folder after having applied the patch 2.13, however the patch should be applied the last.Ferital 19:47, 27 May 2009 (EDT)

The quest from the 2.13 patch and that that comes with the CompUSA are almost identical. There is only a minor difference between them which has no influence on the game play. I created the patch from the file that comes with the CompUSA patch since it is the newest of the twos.--PLRDLF 10:55, 28 May 2009 (EDT)
The one from the CompUSA addon is the oldest since it is dated from September 1996 (it was probably made available when Daggerfall was released). Then it was updated in the 2.13 patch, which was released in 1997. But if the differences are minor, that doesn't matter. :)Ferital 11:16, 28 May 2009 (EDT)

SAVEVARS.DAT[edit]

I couldn't detail my changes in the history log message so I prefer to explain them here. I was the user with IP 82.229.60.25, I only forgot to log in when I edited the page.

I made all those changes because 10 years ago, I made a small program I called Dagrep which let a user view/edit his character reputation by faction and by region. I discovered many things then not covered by the previous DOS editor from Rick Huebner, which I used as a base for making my own program. In particular, I discovered where the region reputation was set in the file.

So basically I edited the SAVEVARDS.DAT section on the savegame page because some things there were erroneous, like the offsets for allies, or the lack of the Vampire Clan ID and Guild Group number.

The offset 0x23 in the file does correspond to a Vampire Clan ID, and is only used by 'country factions', like Daggerfall, Wayrest, Glenpoint and so on. Bytes from offset 0x25 to 0x2E are unknown. If you discovered what they are used for, feel free to edit the page, but please don't remove the Vampire Clan ID since this is a known offset from a long time. If you don't agree, launch Dagrep and see by yourself by hacking the file manually.

Allies and enemies IDs are recorded as long (4 bytes in size). So each ally and enemy is represented by one long.

Also, the previous revision didn't have the Guild Group offset listed.

As for the hex or decimal thing, I'm more into putting it to decimal. That's not only a matter of taste, but also for a matter of readability. A value of FF correspond to -1, always, when it's a value coded in a single byte (for the faction record). For example a faction that does not have a particular race has its race flag set to -1. Such, indicating to the game engine this flag is not used. But as most other things on this page are given in hex values, I will stick with that for the moment.Ferital 11:56, 16 June 2009 (EDT)

Well I must say the 0x23 was my fault I checked it later for a region and it is true. For the third ally/enemy, I've never encounter a faction with more than two allies/enemies, hence I didn't search further. But I tested it and there can be really up to three allies/enemies.
For the SHORT, LONG definition I must say I've never heard about this until I saw these definitions on the hacking pages of the UESP. I never ran across this terms anywhere during my university studies, however I must say I'm an engineer not a computer geek, although I worked with numerous languages back then. I certainly .know what a "byte" is and so on, but "short" eg. "long" was only know to me as definitions for an integer's range. I looked this up and it is obviously a common thing to refer as short for two bytes and as long for four bytes. Because of this "not-knowing" I made some errors when it came to the offset types.--PLRDLF 16:52, 16 June 2009 (EDT)
No problem there. Actually we should have made those definitions clear somewhere on the UESP. Because the definition of a short and a long can vary from one compiler to another, although those definitions (short int as 2 bytes, and long int as 4) are now usual in C/C++. I'm for my part a computer science engineer (a scientific applications C++ coder to be more specific), and you can say a computer geek too.
As for offset 0x25, what does this refers to exatly? I don't know what this 'flag' since I never used it in Dagrep back in the old past, so I let you write the information (I must say I made Dagrep before I became a computer engineer, so the program layout is not very professional...)
For factions with more than two allies/enemies, there are indeed not numerous, usually the game engine makes around 5-10 factions with 3 allies, and the same for factions with 3 enemies. I quickly checked that with Dagrep, but from what I remember of my former experience with the game, this is rarely different.Ferital 18:37, 16 June 2009 (EDT)

Suitability of DFQFIX and FACTFIX[edit]

Lately I've been working on a TES-specific middle-end for DOSBox, and one of the features I thought of adding was automatic updates of Daggerfall thanks to DFQFIX and FACTFIX. Would you have any objection to this, or is there any reason I shouldn't do this? JKing 02:55, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

I've no problems with this, but as the article says, DFQFIX is WIP. Considering FACTFIX I don't know if any further version will follow since bugs in the Reputation-Database are very difficult to detect, because they have almost no influence on the visible game behavior.--PLRDLF 23:53, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

Bug in S0000008 of DFQFIX prior v2.0[edit]

Especially this quest suffers from a nasty bug in the Daggerfall game-engine. The original quest from patch 2.13 has the same bug, but for some reason it will work unless you give the totem to Gothryd or his men. This quest and many other quests in DF use a command to clear quest-flags while the quest is still running. This feature would be useful if some quest-flags need to be checked more than once during a quest, which was probably the original idea behind this command. The problem is, the game-engine interprets this command incorrectly. Let us call this specific command "clear". If a quest flag is "cleared" it can not be activated again, literally it is cleared for ever. The quest flag which causes all this troubles in S0000008 is Flag 1 or Global Variable 1. It is set to "True" at the end of quest S0000015 and indicates that Gothryd has the totem, which is actually true. As soon as the player takes it from the vault, Flag 1 is cleared and can never be set to "True" again. At least not from within the quest. Setting it from inside another active quest works. In conjunction with some other "clear" commands in the quest-file, this causes the bugs in the quest from patch 2.13 and in the quest prior DFQFIX v2.0

For people who use a quest-file prior to v2.0 there is a workaround. I could include it in the next release of DFQFIX but I've no idea when I will have the time to release the next version. If there is an urgent need for this workaround, I might release it sooner.--PLRDLF 22:04, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Well since DFQFIX v2.1 there is a solution for this whole mess. I could spare some time to fix it, since a bug in the main quest, especially near the end, is not a fun thing. I included a start-up file, I called STARTFIN, which can be used by players who are stuck with the main quest prior v2.0. It's very interesting that nobody ever encounter this nasty bug in quest S0000008, but on the other hand who ever wanted to give the totem to Gothryd? There are better rewards one can get and the man is also one dubious character, like most royals in the bay.--PLRDLF 06:20, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Welcome to the disease[edit]

I have nominated you as a Patroller. I hope you accept. --Uniblab 04:11, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

Well I'm touched for the nomination, but I have been nominated already a year ago and I didn't answer the call back then and now for following reasons:
  1. I don't know if or how much time i can spend in the future to distribute to the site. and a patroller should visit the site frequently.
  2. There seem to be enough competent people who can take care of the MW, OB and other sections of this Wiki. Most of my work was done for DF and even as a normal user I would continue my distributions if it is possible. So I think it's not important which status I have.
  3. As I've already clarified English isn't my native language and although I think I'm rather good with it, I belive that when It comes to phrasing and re-writing articles a native speaker is far better than me. So I also can't do much when it comes to this things. — Unsigned comment by PLRDLF (talkcontribs) at 15:19 on 10 September 2009

S000006[edit]

Each use of the robe will release one of the seducers, permitting one to deliver the robe w/o harming Lord Castellian. Does your patch permit this contingency? --Uniblab 22:34, 20 December 2009 (UTC)

You were right, it was my mistake, I've corrected this on the quest page. The quest patch I've created doesn't alter any enemies, it only unlocks the door of the residence, since it is always a type1 house, which is always locked, and replaces the flat of Lord Castellian for a dead body if the Seducers show up and kill him. Thanks for any kind of feedback, because it helps improving the quest patch, even when your remark has nothing to to with it. It's difficult to fix existing bugs in my patches, because I must find them on my own since nobody says something about them to me. Occasionally, people comment about them on the various forums, which is the only way I can learn of possible problems.--PLRDLF 21:01, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

Daggerfall Controls[edit]

Hey,PLRDLF, I see that you've been doing some work on the Daggerfall Controls page. Just so you know, the same user who created had already posted the same (or similar) info here. I didn't do anything because I have never played Daggerfall so I didn't know what to do with it, but may know. Just a heads up ;) --MC S'drassa T2M 21:57, 28 December 2009 (UTC)

I've seen this contribution already and I didn't undo them because:
  1. I thought one of the patrollers would do it.
  2. Although almost all informations are already present at one or another page here, I didn't want to discourage the user who posted them because he obviously has put some efforts in his work.
But If you look at his contribution you will notice that it isn't even formated, beside many other deficiencies.
Considering the key controls, this page has been created by the same user who has contributed at the Unofficial FAQ page, as you already said. User Joram put his information into a table and I overworked the table. I never thought that it would be necessary to list all key-functions of the game, put now the are there nonetheless.--PLRDLF 13:35, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

DFQFIX in DaggerfallSetup[edit]

Hello, I am working on a setup for Daggerfall. This setup is done for install a ready to use Daggerfall easily on modern Windows Systems with the help of the DOS-emulator DOSBox (Like GOG Setup). I include of course all official stuff (Patch 2.13, CompUSA, Fixsave), but I also include unofficial bugs fix and quest. Can I include DFQFIX and FACTFIX ? Thanks in advance and thanks for your work.--Ancestral ghost 18:40, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

I've no problems with this, actually there was a similar question from User JKing some time ago and back then I already said it would be no problem to use these patches in any third-party updater/installer.--PLRDLF 18:20, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
Thanks.(: --Ancestral Ghost 00:00, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Wereboar vs Werewolf[edit]

Hey PLRDLF, I wanted to bring up an edit you made to the Lore:Clavicus Vile page, where it stated that to obtain the Masque the player had to kill a Wereboar. If I'm not mistaken, it's definetely a Werewolf you have to kill instead. I haven't played DF in a while, but am I mistaken? I've already changed the edit to what I believe is correct. -- Jplatinum16 23:06, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

Sorry it was my mistake, it's a werewolf and only a werewolf.--PLRDLF 21:26, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

Error on opening with Dmpquest[edit]

Hello,
I have an error when I try to open a ".qrc" file from DFDFIX with Dmpquest : "Error in header. Incorrects offsets. 1, 5, and 6 should be equal.". How can I edit theses files without have problem, I need to open it for translate it.
Thanks.--Ancestral Ghost 00:26, 9 May 2010 (UTC)

I've never used Dmpquest to edit the quest I've fixed, I use another method, which can built quests from the scratch without any blank (like it is required by Dmpquest). This method creates files that can be used by the game-engine, but they are not "Bethesda-Files". Dmpquest is only capable of opening "Bethesda-Files" (tested this myself), hence my files are not compatible with it. The developers certainly had some sort of quest-editor of their own, but since it was never released we will never know for sure. I was thinking about releasing the method I'm using for some time, but this means I have to provide an exhaustive documentation. But neither I'm having time to write such a documentation, at that in English, nor can I say whether I will have time for this in the near future. However if the number of text-blocks wasn't changed (neither added a new message nor removed an existing), the original QRC file can be used. The quest-text is the only component of a quest which is not stored in the savegame (quest-text can be altered even when the quest is running, adding/removing messages changes the internal numeration of these messages. For example spelling mistakes can be fixed with a hex-editor without any problems).--PLRDLF 22:11, 9 May 2010 (UTC)
OK, Thanks. I will wait the documentation.--Ancestral Ghost 02:10, 10 May 2010 (UTC)
I'm interested in this too :) --DelphiSnake 19:03, 17 September 2010 (UTC)
As a matter of fact the documentation needed to understand this method would be rather exhaustive. The best way to do this would be to create a page similar to the wiki for the Construction Set of Oblivion, but for a single person with little time this is too much. And second, the English documentation would be even more time consuming. I could theoretically write a documentation in my native language, where I've the proper words to explain everything exhaustively. But a translation into English would be as time consuming as writing the original. Only some informations about the Method:
It's a script-like language originally designed by Donald Tipton, who was one of the first persons that developed some very useful tools for the original Daggerfall-Game back then. Theoretically you can construct and modify any quests you like, as long as the game-engine can process it. I discovered this script-language quite some time ago and used it to correct all quest-bugs I could find. And only very little documentation comes with this script-language, Tipton removed all tools and their documentations after someone displeased him, at last this is the rumor. And this little documentation is written in a very complicated way and at least in my opinion, difficult to understand. So I had to figure out how this language works from the scratch and even now I sometimes learn some new things when I've time to occupy myself with it.--PLRDLF 21:54, 17 September 2010 (UTC)
Does this mean you have a copy of Tipton's TEMPLATE (packaged as tplbin.zip)?
I would be happy to get any tools you have, even without documentation. Thanks! --DelphiSnake 18:02, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
Yes, this is the tool curretly v1.01, it's the only one I haven't added to the files section, since it has almost no useable documentation and no source-code. All other tools that I have are already in the files section.--PLRDLF 01:29, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
Thanks for the info :) I'm still hoping someone has a more recent version of TEMPLATE, the .zip should be ~340 kb. I think that version does contain complete documentation.-- DelphiSnake 08:06, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
Hi again, I found the documentation for Template. However, I'm not sure whether the documentation is for the version 1.01 we have, or for a later version. It's a bit messy, I'll clean it up some time in the next couple of days. Are you willing to post the source of the DFQFIX quest files? I think that will help me figure out what commands are different between versions of Template. Thanks! --DelphiSnake 13:38, 4 October 2010 (UTC)
I've already added comments inside the source files when I created them, however there are certainly some misspellings in this comments and I don't have time to fix this. But I believe this shouldn't be a problem. If I knew where I should upload them to, I could do this as soon as I've the time.--PLRDLF 07:18, 23 October 2010 (UTC)
Hi, I finally obtained a more recent version of TEMPLATE. This is v1.11, and it is packaged with complete documentation from Donald Tipton. I've uploaded it to my website, slushpool.fortunecity.com (any recommendations on a free host with ftp upload would be welcomed! :D). There are some of his other tools up there too. I hope this helps you. -- DelphiSnake 14:54, 27 May 2011 (UTC)
Thanks for the message, I've used v1.01 for the DFQFIX and as it was finished in autumn 2010 I've no immediate use for v1.11, but I will look into it nonetheless. Judging from all of Timpton's documentation I've read so far, it's probably written in a very complicated way, even in case it's complete. The best way to put this program into use would be to create a page similar to the scripting portal at http://cs.elderscrolls.com. But even then this would be a lot of work and the main question is, who would use a Daggerfall Quest-Editor nowadays? If Daggerfall XL is perhaps someday released in the distant future, it will certainly have a quest-editor of its own. Surely, there a are a still a lot of people that play Daggerfall or started to play it recently, but the majority of the people play MW, OB, or will play the upcoming SR, of which I'm not very fond of after the information I've read. Again a majority of the game-play that forms a classical RPG is thrown away. No classes, birthsigns and even fewer skills than in Oblivion (using a dagger is certainly not the same as using a longsword for example) and only health, magic and fatigue, a joke. And again a lame story "You are the mighty dragon-slayer blah, blah", sounds as lame as the story of Oblivion. These ES-games turn more and more into ego-shooters e.g. ego-slashers, with every new game of the series. Certainly, the graphic gets always better and better, but this can be expected with the advancing computer technology.
For the free FTP server, I don't know of such a thing, I may even need one for myself.--PLRDLF 21:32, 27 May 2011 (UTC)

Thank You[edit]

Choco chip cookie.png
You have been given a cookie!

Your dedication and diligence to the wiki has not gone unnoticed. A user has seen the progress you've made, and has given you a cookie because of it. Good work! The user had the following to say:

Thank you for all your work on the Daggerfall pages. I know you don't care much about things like this, but I think it's important that you get thanks for the fantastic edits you've made to the DF pages. I hope you still want to keep going to finish the rest off. rpeh •TCE 23:32, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

Small Question on my Userpage[edit]

There's a small question on my userpage that I think you'd know more about than I would, so if you get some time, would you mind taking a look? --Tim Talk 01:19, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

LOL[edit]

On of your userboxes says your right handed, but if you think about it, the picture is a left hand. Mikeyboy52 02:47, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

I'm surprised anyone looks at this page, but if you look clearly, it's indeed a right hand. Beside, this image is used for all right hand users on this wiki. No hard feelings.--PLRDLF 23:36, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

Question about Daggerfall Add-ons:[edit]

I really wanted to know how to install the addons and stuff, for example the addon called "andyfell.zip" and "daedrafell.zip" and "addquest.zip" and "mirror.zip". Can you tell me how to install those? Tim (Timmeh or whatever he calls himself) advised that I run that question by you. Thanks a ton! ~Eirreann of Vvardenfell; 09:51 p.m., 8 June 2010

Most mods, if not all, come with a ReadMe of some sort. There you can learn how to install it. Perhaps I will write an explanation for some of these mods, if I've time. Some of them I've never played myself though.--PLRDLF 00:41, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
Ah! I see now! Thanks! --Eirreann of Vvardenfell 08:28, 10 June 2010

Hey[edit]

Hey PLRDLF, your talk page is huge why dont you archive it (if you dont want to can I do it I need practice) Arny 08:21, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

You can do this if you want. I've never paid such things much attention.--PLRDLF 00:37, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

Redguard DOSBox crash[edit]

I noticed your note about Redguard crashing in DOSBox. Would it be possible to send me a saved game near the crash point in question? I don't doubt that you're correct about there being no solution, but I would nevertheless like to see for myself. Also, you may wish to change the relevant DOSBox compatibility page (on the DOSBox Web site, that is) to make note of this. JKing 13:00, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

I've a savegame exactly before this point I could send it to you, when I've access to an E-Mail account at the end of the week. I've never completed the game until now, although I'm far beyond this critical point (thanks to an old Pentium III with MS-DOS 6.22). I haven't had the opportunity and/or time for this since last autumn, and I want to solve the game on my own without a walkthrough. Considering the DOSBox compatibility page, I'm not a big fan of registering at Web-Pages and you must register there to add something to these pages. Perhaps someone can do this instead.--PLRDLF 03:50, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

error in DFQFIX / R0C11Y28[edit]

Hello,

This post, just to inform you of an error in quest R0C11Y28 in DFQFIX : http://www.uesp.net/w/index.php?title=File_talk:DFQFIX.ZIP&oldid=609568

Regards

This "error" comes already with the original quest on the Daggerfall-CD. I didn't look into the quest-text in detail, beside it's only a typo. Perhaps some day I will release a corrected quest-text file. I haven't played Daggerfall for some time now and the DFQFIX is de-facto also completed, so this may take some time, but thanks anyway.--PLRDLF 23:04, 4 January 2011 (UTC)

Just wanted to...[edit]

..point you towards this interesting opportunity, as you are our DF/BS expert no. 1. --Krusty 22:33, 13 April 2011 (UTC)

Daggerfall Totem "Myth"[edit]

Hi PLRDLF. You recently removed the note on Daggerfall:Journey to Aetherius about the player being killed by the Numidium. I've never gotten very far in the main quest, but if this is in fact a myth then it's been spread around the wiki quite a bit. The War in the West simply says that contact was lost with the "Blades agent" (the player) after the event. Since you seem to be the most familiar with Daggerfall, I was wondering if you know of any kind of evidence that suggests the player dies at the end of the main quest. If not, should it be removed from the lore articles? Thanks. Legoless 01:58, 1 May 2011 (UTC)

Well at least in the game Daggerfall it's not possible to be killed by Numidium. If you don't give the totem away before the 360 days have passed it will simple vanquish from your inventory, but that is it. Naturally you can't do the last quest of the Main-Story in this case and can't complete it. I've read "The Warp in the West" when I did play Oblivion and in my opinion the whole story in this book is just a makeshift to connect the plot of Daggerfall with the "Past-Daggerfall" lore, or nobody of the Oblivion developers knew anything back from the possible outcomes of Daggerfall. The end of the Main-Story in Daggerfall is very onesided, whoever gets the totem wins and gets the ultimate power to dominate the bay. The scenario that all possible outcomes of the Main-Quest did occur at the same time, as mentioned in "The Warp in the West" is not true for Daggerfall. The plot of Daggerfall is only canonical with the rest of TES lore if the player decides to give the totem to the Blades. They will use Numidium to hold the remaining realms of the bay at bay, perhaps during this action the other four kingdoms were able to acquire the territories they have past Daggerfall. The Underking dies for good in all outcomes of the game. Regarding the player, like all other games of the TES series, you can keep playing after you have completed the Main-Quest. Perhaps your character did finally meet his doom in one of those gigantic dungeons throughout the Iliac Bay sometimes after the end of the MQ. But this remains to ones own imagination.--PLRDLF 23:04, 2 May 2011 (UTC)
The whole myth comes from the official strategy guide, The Daggerfall Chromicles. It mentions this supposed alternate ending, though it was never implemented in-game.74.222.102.175 07:37, 11 May 2015 (GMT)

FACTFIX[edit]

Hello again, I've looked over Daggerfall's faction.txt and found more errors that I have fixed. I have made these fixes on my DF installation on top of the fixes you made available in FACTFIX.zip. I have a few more things I need to change then to test it. After that I plan to distribute it. I'm not sure whether you are planning on doing more work on faction.txt yourself.

Would you prefer that I upload my changes as a different patch, or would it be ok to package and upload it as FACTFIX v1.3? I will upload it to my website before I upload it here so you can look at what I've changed before deciding. Thanks :) -- DelphiSnake 21:22, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

I've not concerned myself with this file very much. I've only fixed the errors I've seen on first sight. Therefore there may be more errors left, but from my experience the data in this file has very little impact on the game itself, hence errors are extremely difficult to find. I've no problem when you plan to release a more up to date version of this file than I've already done.--PLRDLF 13:00, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

S0000106 in DFQFIX 0.30 : why ?[edit]

Hello, the quest S0000106.qrc has always been an empty quest (no dialogs inside) : what kind of correction have you made inside ? It's still empty anyway... I'd like some precisions for updating the PFD project (french translation for Daggerfall) accordingly. Regards

The quest dindn't give you the reputation you should get before. Now it does, only the qbn file was altered since there was never any dialog for this "quest".

P0B10L08[edit]

Hello,
I did a very little fix for the P0B10L08/P0B1XL08 quest, this vampire quest with the misnamed QBN : File:P0B10L08.ZIP. You can add it directly in DFQFIX if you want for avoid to people to download again a new file.--Ancestral Ghost 10:55, 14 February 2012 (UTC)

Thanks, I've noticed that, but the reason why I never have done anything about this quest was, I believe people can easily rename a file themself, even such people who used nothing but a GUI their whole life to operate a computer (right-button click of the mouse in most cases).--PLRDLF 01:28, 16 February 2012 (UTC)
Yes, in theory everybody can rename this file. But in fact, people don't know the bug and don't rename the file. With this, people can see the bug, it's the main interest of this fix. Rename the file directly without have to search the QBN in the mass of Arena2 files is just bonus.--Ancestral Ghost 21:43, 24 February 2012 (UTC)

Daggerfall Editing Textures page[edit]

I posted about this over here and was referred to you. I happened to notice this page in the Daggerfall namespace earlier when watching the Recent Changes page, and it seemed a little iffy to me. I don't know anything about Daggerfall at all, so the page subject matter seemed pretty legitimate (to my uninformed self) even if possibly placed in the wrong area. It doesn't seem to be written in a 'professional' or 'encyclopedic' style, though (particularly the swear word right smack in the middle of it), and since I'm so unfamiliar with the way pages are handled in the Daggerfall namespace, and RH referred to you as the resident Daggerfall master, I'm bringing this to you. Do with it what you will. :) ABCface 02:32, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

Request[edit]

Will you recheck this page as there is a LOT of missing info now. The Silencer 21:37, 25 March 2012 (UTC)
What missing info?--PLRDLF 21:40, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

(Normal) Dry Blocks

N0000027 Skull telePORT 80,109,37,86,132,125

Attic eight door room/three floor elevator

N0000053 Attic eight door room/three floor elevator

The data in between the numbers 27 & 53 is gone.

All data is there again, somehow it got lost, already some years ago.--PLRDLF 22:02, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Daggerfall Pages[edit]

Before you undo all that stuff, maybe we could discuss it on the talk page? At the very least, could you please not revert to the previous versions of the text that was kept in, since there were a bunch of grammar mistakes until I fixed them? ThuumofReason 17:29, 19 May 2012 (UTC)
Specifically, you're undoing a lot of edits that were made as cleanup. A lot of the stuff listed in those articles is padding; it's not necessary to list every single detail, and much of what you're reverting to is unfit for a wiki article. I realize that English isn't your first language, but it is mine, so I would ask that you trust my judgment on the changes I made to the wording. Also, I suggest you take some time to get reacquainted with wiki policies and procedures so you can avoid undoing constructive edits in the future. ThuumofReason 17:36, 19 May 2012 (UTC)
Yes Englisch isn't nor is it one of my favorites, but I'm not complaining that false grammar etc. is corrected nor would I. But I don't understand for example why info on static enemies is removed from a walkthrough or in case of the Direnni Tower, why the way back out should be removed. A part of Direnni Tower contains the "dreaded red brick teleporter maze" and I believe some players may be grateful that they know how to get out (if you can't get out, you can't proceed with the quest). Not every character has the recall spell and can get out so fast. I'm not boasting, but almost all serious or "wikified" info on Daggerfall here comes from me, except for FAQ, tips and tricks etc. I literally rebuilt it from scratch since 2008, which took a couple of years. Almost all walkthroughs for the 228 + 16 quests were written by me, the ones from the main quest were already there, but only in the form of passages from the DF-Chronicles, which I also considered to be redundant. The entire graphical walkthrough was also done by me, although the idea to do this was not mine I confess. I dug into the guts of this game and turned it upside down over the years, so I believe it's safe when I'm saying I know what I've written (grammar spelling aside). Of course I'm not without fail as anyone else.
Certainly walkthroughs may contain a personal touch to some degree, it's therefore arguable how much they should be altered. On the other hand I only provided additional info for players I deemed to be be useful e.g. "take the treasures in the Direnni Tower as long as you are levitating" ,people may not know there are even treasures. But I think I kept the walkthroughs fairly "professional" since the various patrollers considered all these articles to be fit over the years. And since most quest-bugs were fixed over the years, a couple of walkthroughs for quest which were originally broken do contain info how to do them with a fixed quest and some notes what is broken or how bugs may be avoided. This can be considered technical background info on the quest. I don't think a walkthrough should be a simple "go there, do this" since some quests in DF can't be done this way. When a quest can go into two directions how should one write a walkthrough without the words "eventually, "maybe", ... ? And a word on the note regrding Helseth's quest, quite a few people kept asking, how was it possible that he knew the player had read the letter? I mentioned a wax seal was very common and nobody has ever asked "how did he know" again.
Once again correcting grammar, spelling is no problem but removing useful info from the walktrough or from articles may be critical, example the soul trap spell. People coming from the newer games may know how these things work, but others may not know this. Players think, I want to join there and there because they have these great soul gems I can use to create awesome items and then they will recognize, firstly they will need the soul trap spell and secondly their warrior character will never be able to cast it. If they had known this in the first place, they wouldn't be in this awkward situation now, after they worked up their way through the ranks.
And the reason why I did changes that quick is, when I have the opportunity to visit here and know a change is indeed incorrect e.g. the previous changes to the Mages Guild quest, I correct this as soon as I've noticed it. Currently I don't have the time to go through a huge number of changes and check them for logical errors or similar stuff, not for grammar or spelling this isn't my stuff. Since most patrollers don't pay that much attention to DF articles or the DF namespace generally and sadly don't have much knowledge of this game as well, it would very likely be me who has to look into all these changes for which I don't have the time.--PLRDLF 22:32, 19 May 2012 (UTC)
I get that, but I don't think you fully understand what does and does not belong on a wiki article. I'm going to post several relevant selections from the style guide, which explain why the edits I made were justified.
The quest walkthrough should focus on quest-specific information: what the quest objectives are and how to complete those objectives. It should not try to provide comprehensive information on all locations visited during the quest page. Each of those places should have pages that provide separate place-specific walkthroughs.
If necessary, we can make pages for the dungeons, but the article on the quest should remain strictly relevant to the quest. Mentioning each enemy is not relevant to the quest, so it should only be done on the place page. For strong enemies that people need to know they'll be facing, like Vampire Ancients, it's important to note so they know what to expect.
The quest walkthrough should not provide information on every piece of loot that you may collect while going through a dungeon -- the place page is where that type of comprehensive information should be provided. Instead, the quest walkthrough should only describe any "notable" treasure. That typically includes:
  • Quest-specific items (required to complete the quest, or rewards for the quest)
  • Unique items that cannot be obtained anywhere else in the game
  • Skill books
  • Extremely rare items (e.g., Daedra Hearts, Flawless Rubies, Skyrim:Pearls)
  • Boss chests
Since there are no chests in Daggerfall, and all treasure is random, none of these apply anyway.
The bugs section of the page should always be titled "Bugs" (for consistency, so other articles can reliably link to the bugs section). It should include information on all quest-specific bugs, in particular bugs that may prevent you from starting or completing the quest.
This is what you see on all articles in the Oblivion and Skyrim namespaces: Bugs belong in a separate section, not the quest walkthrough.
Third party mods are generally mentioned in game articles only when they are widely used to fix a described glitch or gripe.
Which is why it's perfectly acceptable to mention the fixes made by DFQFix. Again, you see the same thing in articles in the Oblivion and Skyrim namespaces.
ThuumofReason 23:15, 19 May 2012 (UTC)
I haven't kept track of the Daggerfall edits, but I noticed that, in the Skyrim namespace, game-, save-, or quest-breaking bugs are mentioned in the walkthrough or somewhere other than the bugs section, especially if everyone has the bug, and then the full description of the bug along with possible fixes are mentioned in the bugs section. An unwritten rule, I think. I don't know if any of these are in Daggerfall, though. Vely►Talk►Email 23:21, 19 May 2012 (UTC)
Daggerfall should not be compared to Oblivion never mind Skyrim with its large amount of incomplete quest walkthroughs. The only two Skyrim quests that qualify should be the featured ones, Skyrim:Forbidden Legend and Skyrim:The Only Cure. I have no expierience with Daggerfall so couldn't comment on accuracy, but if these pages have been good for years, what has changed? The Silencer has spokenTalk 23:29, 19 May 2012 (UTC)
Sorry, but you are referring to newly invented quest page rules for Skyrim pages – Daggerfall is an entirely different ballgame, and there is absolutely no need for all of this cleanup – these pages have existed for years and nobody ever complained until now. Like Elliot, I’d much rather trust the judgment of PLRDLF; he created this entire namespace – and at least he has the Daggerfall userbox on his page. --Krusty 23:47, 19 May 2012 (UTC)
...I'm sorry, so you're saying that we shouldn't change the tone to make it more appropriate for a wiki? You're saying that we shouldn't make improvements? You're saying that just because he created the original article, it shouldn't be changed and he's automatically the final arbiter of what stays and goes? That's completely contrary to everything the guidelines say. I'm sorry Krusty, I just don't buy that. ThuumofReason 23:49, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

() The guidelines for Oblivion and Skyrim may not fit in with Daggerfall as well as those namespaces. You have to consider the content of the games--is Daggerfall fixed or is anything radiant? Are there a lot fewer enemies or loot in dungeons than the other games? What's the namespace's current state in terms of how it's formatted, and does it read easily?

That's what we're talking about--differing guidelines for differing namespaces.

I think that something that would help tremendously would be if someone set up a sandbox with rules for what the namespace currently looks like, and then discuss what parts of that are good and what parts could be improved. Vely►Talk►Email 23:56, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Why do I get the feeling that nobody has even looked at the edits I made before and after? Differing guidelines is one thing, but saying that we shouldn't change it at all is patently false. When you're responding to this comment, scroll down and start reading the part that says "Any changes will be visible..." Different guidelines is one thing, but there is still a general format that all wiki articles follow. Are you saying that it's okay for Daggerfall namespace articles to have poor grammar, improper tone, perspective problems, etc.? These are not guidelines for the newer games; they are listed as guidelines for editing articles across the site. Click on style guide and tell me where it says that the things I quoted don't apply to all articles, just the ones from Oblivion and Skyrim. I realize I'm getting worked up over this, but it really irritates me that just because it's Daggerfall, nobody is willing to accept changes. Why not permanently protect the entire Daggerfall namespace if you don't want it changed?ThuumofReason 00:08, 20 May 2012 (UTC)
ThuumofReason I realize that you are trying to explain your point but, it could be said in a Shorter and less offending/annoying paragraph, Maybe, you do get easily worked up, I'll give you that, but, perhaps you could tone it down a little. The Staff have decided what they want to do with the pages, leave it alone. Ziguildmaster 00:16, 20 May 2012 (UTC)
I haven't played Daggerfall either, however, I thought I should add to the discussion in hope of helping to reach some workable solutions.
First, I think DFQFix should be given somewhat more consideration than just "a third party mod". At a minimum, it's more comparable to UOP and USIP -- it is the community's standard tool for fixing the game's bugs. Furthermore, DFQFix is available to every Daggerfall player (unlike UOP/USIP which cannot be used by Xbox/PS3 players). Arguably, we should even assume that all players have installed DFQFix, and that therefore it should be the standard to which articles should be written (just as Oblivion articles are written assuming that players have installed all official patches, even though there will be some small fraction of players who are still playing the game out of the box, without any patches). Anyone reading our site who is playing Daggerfall without DFQFix is choosing to do so, and has therefore chosen to play a sub-standard version of the game and has chosen to deal with the consequences of the bugs.
Second, one concern with some of the changes I've seen on Daggerfall articles is that substantial amounts of content have been removed. PLRDLF has put a huge amount of work into writing the existing content and researching all of the information, so it's somewhat disrespectful to remove that work outright. If the argument is that the content describes a bug, then the information should be moved to a bugs section. If the content describes an optional route, then a way should be found to make it clear that it is optional. Perhaps move it to the end of the walkthrough so it doesn't interrupt the rest of the flow. Or put it into a show/hide box. If you think information is to dungeon-specific to be on a quest page, then it should be moved to the relevant dungeon page -- and if no such page exists, then the content should not be removed (and the quest guidelines are irrelevant because they're written assuming that there is a separate dungeon page).
Third, the style guidelines are guidelines not hard rules. Plus they're guidelines written with Skyrim and Oblivion in mind, meaning that a large amount of leeway needs to be added when considering the older games. If you're writing new content, it's best to try to write the content based on the guidelines. But existing content does not need to be retrofitted and forced to fit exactly into the guidelines. Changes made to existing content should be made with the goal of unambiguously improving the articles -- in particular adding any missing information that the guidelines now suggest should be included. However, it's best to only remove information from articles if it blatantly needs to be removed -- if it's incorrect or misleading, or if it's really not contributing anything useful to the article.
Finally, I'm not trying to say that ThuumofReason was wrong to make any of his edits. He was making his best effort to improve the articles, and all editors should feel free to be bold when editing. However, now that it's clear that there's some disagreement over what exactly should be done with the articles, we should try to find some way of improving the articles that satisfies both PLRDLF's and ThuumofReason's concerns. It's not a question of selecting "revision A" or "revision B" -- it's a question of coming up with a new "revision C". --NepheleTalk 00:19, 20 May 2012 (UTC)
Addendum: I don't think anyone is questioning whether grammar/spelling errors should be fixed. I do think PLRDLF went too far in undoing all the grammar/spelling errors as well as the content issues -- however, he has already explained why he did that, and I can understand his position. The goal now should be to create a version of the article that contains both ThuumofReason's grammar/spelling fixes, while simultaneously keeping the content that PLRDLF is arguing needs to be kept on the page. Neither of these two versions of the page is a "good" version of the page. --NepheleTalk 00:26, 20 May 2012 (UTC)
Thank you, Nephele. I appreciate you taking the time to understand my side of the issue, and I can agree with the points you made about the changes. ThuumofReason 00:31, 20 May 2012 (UTC)
There has been more Daggerfall relevant discussion in just a few hours than it has been in the last couple of years, very strange. Basically there are only a couple of things confusing me that I'm concerned about
  • Enemies
For example all the "enemies" that were recently removed from the walkthrough of the Wayrest Painting can be vampires if the games decides so, since ThuumofReason deemed such enemies especially mentionable. Especially for higher class characters these "random" enemies can be though foes and you can't almost enter a dungeon without encountering vampire ancients, which may be only skeletons at lower levels. Also which enemies are deemed to be dangerous is arguable and depends mostly on your character and its level. For a level 1 character imps are deadly foes, for middle-level characters they are nothing than a nuisance. Therefore I don't get the point why enemies one will definitely come across shall be removed from a walkthrough, even when you can't say what type they will be.
  • Treasures
If you stumble across a treasure pile when you enter a room on your way to the quest object why not mention it in the walkthrough? All criteria for the later games relating to treasures/items don't apply for DF as was already mentioned. There is only random loot in this game, random to the extend, when you reload a save before you took the loot and take it again, it will be a completely different assortment of items. I didn't mention loot two levels downstairs in the walkthroughs, just stuff you will stumble across or that is just in the room opposite of the one you currently are.
  • Alternative routes
Well this only applies for the Direnni Tower and Castle Wayrest, since in all other dungeons you can just go the same way back you have come from. But when you go through a teleporter maze the way back is somewhat different from the way you have previously come from. I believe getting out is as important as getting in and the recall spell isn't basic equipment for the player's character, e.g. it's not that uncommon even for experienced players forgetting to set a recall anchor at the entrance.
  • Removing useful information from articles in general
Example, removing the note the soul trap spell is needed for soul gems to work, which also points to the magic page telling this is a rather magic-heavy spell, even for a spellcasting character. Players coming from newer games may know how soul gems work, but others may not know this. It's also not that comprehensible that one will also need a spell when one already has the case (if you have already a bottle you can simply fill it, you would think). And even players advanced in TES ways may learn that there is only one type of soul gem in DF and that it's a magic-heavy spell.
  • Rephrasing text taken directly from the game
I believe the wiki policies even say this shouldn't be done, however I don't know exactly what they currently say about correcting spelling errors.
What was disturbing me in the first place was changing a walktrough twice even after I've pointed out these were two different quests, this could have been easily checked. By the way, I don't make things up when I post or publish something. I don't have problems when phrases like "you will be in trouble" etc., are removed from an article, I don't use such wording when I write unemotional articles, or spelling and grammar is corrected. Some of mine are just oversights others because I may really not know the common wording. But as I've already said, when a quest can take two different directions, how should one write a walktrough without words like "maybe", "perhaps", ... ?
I'm only concerned about the things I've pointed out and I tried to write the walkthoughs as accurate as possible, so even the simplest of mind or people who don't understand that much English can follow.--PLRDLF 21:45, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

DFQFIX bug ?[edit]

Maybe a bug with DFQFIX Reported by a DaggerfallSetup user :

Also, I don't know if this is related, but while doing certain Temple quests (this occurs randomly and I don't know precisely what quest or quests), the game will crash when receiving your reward. Not only that, but it will corrupt all future quests for any guild in the same manner and will make it impossible to fast travel to any far away place such as Wayrest as it will crash to desktop upon arrival. Don't know if this is related to the unofficial fixes, but it does happen on vanilla Daggerfall quests while using them

--Ancestral Ghost 18:09, 24 June 2012 (UTC)

I've never encountered any of these problems myself except the random crashing from time to time, but rather rarely. When this happens I reload a savegame before I took the reward and than the game proceeds normally. I only use v2.13, Tipton's patch and mine. According to my experiences, Daggerfall seems to be more instable under DosBox 0.74 than it has been under 0.73. However I've been using v0.74 for years and don't want to go back to v0.73 for a couple of reasons. From the date I assume this special problem has been solved and sorry for the rather late answer--PLRDLF (talk) 17:32, 3 September 2012 (EDT)
Hello, sadly this was not solved and users still report it. The problem is, we have not idea on which DaggerfallSetup component is bugged. I am sure the base game included in is clean, so then, it's one of the optional content. DaggerfallSetup is used by many people, and this bug is game breaking, it's really annoying. You seem know good Daggerfall mechanics, maybe have you an idea ? More informations on the bug here--Ancestral Ghost (talk) 13:03, 25 June 2013 (GMT)
Yes, yes, I've read about this problem on the BS forum and here on the UESP forum as well, already some time ago. The problem is, I don't have an account on any Internet site beside the UESP and I wouldn't have created one back then if it hadn't been necessary to upload images and other files. And I don't plan to create an user account anywhere else either. The Internet and everything that comes with it are simply not my cup of tea, By the way I was really annoyed that "Steam" was the only option to run TES V. Therefore anything that goes on on the various foris (forum = latin and means marketplace by the way, so foris is the correct term in this context) etc. doesn't concern me, because I can't do anything there. But back to the problem. I've run into this problem back when I was playing the game the first times also and a solution is already here if you look under the Topic "corrupted savegames". I'm pretty sure the files from the savegame slots, especially the file RUMOR.DAT, are the cause for the problem. If you take a close look into the ARENA2 folder, you will notice that all files from a saveslot are copied to the ARENA2 folder if you load the specific savegame. The file RUMOR.DAT contains the rumors and gossips for active or completed quests. When a quest is completed e.g. terminated (quest time has run out) this file gets updated and this may cause the freeze or other strange behavior. Apparently at some point this file gets corrupted in some way. Apparently this is a DosBox related problem, because I don't believe this problem has also appeared back then when Daggerfall was still used with a MS-DOS compatible OS. Try to mess around with the file RUMOR.DAT. Remove it and maybe the other files that contain the map-data for locations you have already visited from the ARENA2 directory before you start the game. RUMOR.DAT contains only the rumors so it is save to remove it completely from the savegame slot if it's corrupted beyond the point of the game's repair capabilities. It gets cleared out anyway as the game-time moves on. I've been using a simple bat-file for ages to clear the ARENA2 folder before starting the game and in conjunction with dos32a I've never had any quest related crashes, or the problem was fixed after I've reloaded the savegame before turning in the quest for the reward. This is all I can say about this, try it and if it works maybe you should consider adding such a bat-file cleaner/starter for your next update.--PLRDLF (talk) 23:02, 18 August 2013 (GMT)

Battlespire Images![edit]

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You have been given a cookie!

Your dedication and diligence to the wiki has not gone unnoticed. A user has seen the progress you've made, and has given you a cookie because of it. Good work! The user had the following to say:

What a surprise! Never thought I'd see high-quality Battlespire images like that. If you're planning on working in the Battlespire namespace, you might be interested in the Spin-off Series Completion Project. Not much going on at the moment, but it's a nice central hub for Battlespire-related activity. —Legoless (talk) 00:17, 26 November 2012 (GMT)

Greetings![edit]

Nice to see that you're still alive and kicking!--Ratwar (talk) 13:57, 26 December 2013 (GMT)

In fact this gives my the opportunity to clarify something, regarding exactly this type of wording. I would never abandon anything I'm doing online or in general, without saying something in advance, unless I really would die abruptly. And this is something no one is save of. I wouldn't abandon any project I'm working on, without saying anything, like many people do. However there is nothing really special regarding TES at the moment I'm doing, except that I'm rerunning MW for a couple of month now using Wine this time, gathering some experience and putting them somewhere they are useful.--PLRDLF (talk) 01:26, 29 December 2013 (GMT)

Crashes with lockpicks[edit]

I just noted that you edited lockpicks/probes causing crashes, and I think I stumbled on exactly the same today in another context. It's probably wyremash related (see http://wryemusings.com/ESTemplate.ini). Since Morrowind editor IDs are not unique, a list of possible record types that can be pointed to is given in each case. Suspiciously CELL.NAME_NEXT.ID is missing REPA, LOCK and PROB as types, repair tools, lockpicks and probes. May be totally unrelated of course too, I just thought I mention it. --Alfwyn (talk) 01:04, 19 January 2014 (GMT)

Thanks for the info, but I think this problem it's related to FrameOptimizer, since Wrye Mash doesn't change anything related to this topic in plugins and lockpicks and probes do work normally if FrameOptimizer is not used (in interior cells this applications is not as useful as it is outdoors). Maybe it is also related to texture and mesh replacers for lockpicks and probes I've installed, I haven't tried the game without these replacers, but I doubt it. I'm not playing a thief/stealth character in my current game so lockpicks and probes are of no use to me, except for selling them. and just keeping them in the character's inventory or picking them up from another inventory causes no problems at all. It is just somewhat of an indicator, that there are probes and/or lockpicks in the current cell. And if you approach a probe/lockpick with your character's backside turned towards the item, the game will also not crash.--PLRDLF (talk) 00:23, 21 January 2014 (GMT)

Alternative MQ-DF Werbeast[edit]

Hej PLRDLF, greetings. Probably you don't know me. I am working for some years now on a german translation of Daggerfall (www.daggerfalldeutsch.de), wrote an in-depth guide about this game and been named in the community as one of the last German Daggerfall experts (even though most people don't know your genius work - so well don't like to get that much attention - but would really like to get in touch a bit more with you because you were really deep into the game itself with your DFQFIX). Anyway, I wanted to ask you about the alternative way of the S0000007 Quest. In DFQFIX you implemented Tiptons alternative way of the questpack. The questpack is, as far as I know, unofficial(?). So it's something we would like to avoid and doing it later as an "optional" add-on. We are using DFQFIX for the whole translation process and so there is a question about it. How did you work on this quest? Did you fix in this quest just the alternative way, or are there other bugs been found in the original file which you also fixed? On this matter it depends If I do an exception and implement it as it comes with DFQFIX or using the "original"-version. Maybe you can remember - my goal is to break the language barrier and make it for many German Player easier to get into this fascinating and gorgeous game. And because "everyone" calls it Buggerfall, I want to have the most up-to-date fix, which we'll get with DFQFIX. Thanks for your time - I will write to you in another matter soon, I think. Otherwise you can get in touch with me at deepfighter[at]tamriel-almanach.de . Greetings! --Deepfighter 15:10, 18 February 2014 (GMT)

Nun, da es sich um eine deutsche Übersetzung handeln soll, Deutsch azudem auch meine Muttersprache ist, ich mich daher auch viel, viel besser in Deutsch ausdrücken kann, als in Englisch, und es auch keine Vorschriften gibt, welche Sprache ich auf meiner "Talk"-Seite verwenden soll, im Gegensatz zur übrigen UESP, werde ich hier auch auf Deutsch antworten. Darum kann ich auch eine weitaus ausführlichere Erklärung geben, anstatt alles mühsam ins Englische übersetzen zu müssen, bei technischen Fragen ist so etwas mehr als nur umständlich.
Ich habe Donald Tiptons alternativen Quest-Weg dahingehend repariert, daß der Teil wo man den Werwolf lebendig fangen kann auch funktioniert. Der andere Teil, den Werwolf zu töten funktioniert ohne Probleme, wie ja schon auf der entsprechenden Seite steht. Das größte Problem mit den Quests in Daggerfall ist die Tatsache, daß die "Engine" des Spiels jeden Vorgang nur ein einziges Mal pro Quest auswerten kann. Also zum Beispiel: Wenn dieser Charakter angeklickt wird, mache dieses und jenes. Das sollte theoretisch jedesmal ausgeführt werden, wenn man den Charakter anklickt, allerdings wird es tatsächlich nur einmal pro laufendem Quest gemacht. Tipton selber hat dieses Problem in seiner Dokumentation angesprochen, hat aber dann wohl darauf vergessen, als er diesen alternativen Weg konzipiert hat. Denn im Zusammenhang mit Cyndassas Freundin, der Hexe, tritt genau so ein Problem auf. Spricht man zu ihr (klickt sie an), passiert überhaupt nichts. Tipton verwendet einen "Clear-Task" Befehl im Quest-Code um "Hexe angeklickt" wieder auf "false" zu setzen, unmittelbar nachdem man sie angeklickt hat. Allerdings bleibt durch die Restriktion der "Engine" dieser "Quest-Task" dann für den Rest des Quests auf "false" gesetzt, egal wie oft man die Hexe dann noch anklickt. Darum reagiert sie auch nicht wenn sie angeklickt wird, daraus folgt, Quest kaputt. Ich habe diese "Clear-Task" Anweisung entfernt, darum bleibt dieser "Task" weiter auf "true" gesetzt, was allerdings keine negativen Auswirkungen hat, und dafür sorgt, daß sie wieder auf das Anklicken reagiert und mit dem Spieler spricht.--PLRDLF (talk) 21:22, 20 February 2014 (GMT)

The True Barenziah[edit]

Hello.
It was recommended that I ask you for help. Could you please take a look at this discussion? Thanks. -- CompleCCity (talk) 15:58, 2 June 2014 (GMT)

Evil in Waiting[edit]

On the Evil in Waiting page, you recently confirmed a bug: "If the opaque vessel is knocked down from the pedestal, the spikes blocking the word wall can be activated by placing an item on it if jumping over does not work." I'm not sure I get it. How is this a bug? It seems to be saying that the spikes are triggered by the pedestal, which is common behaviour for pedestals. Robin Hood  (talk) 12:50, 6 August 2014 (GMT)

The opaque vessel was knocked down from the pedestal during the fight, likely by the draugrs Unrelenting Force shout. It was lying on the ground, however the spikes blocking the word wall didn't go down even when there was no longer any "weight" on the pedestal. Intuitively I took an item from my character's inventory, I believe it was an ebony axe, dropped it on the pedestal and the spikes went down. I don't know how the game-physics for these pedestals exactly work, but apparently not as one would expect (weight gone -> mechanism triggered). I didn't test jumping over the pedestal though, since my character was over-encumbranced and couldn't take a running start.--PLRDLF (talk) 22:12, 16 August 2014 (GMT)

Thank you for the german version of the Daggerfall book: Arkay the God[edit]

I have found the book in german in the game and first I was wondering, cause I´m from germany and how could that be, I have played with the original version in english without any third party content. Then I looked here in this wiki (what is a real treasure for elder scrolls fans) and find no information about this book, but in internet some people have write that it exist. So I maked a note here in discussion of the english book and don´t think that anybody that interested, but really the book was added (I wish I could make it myself but I´m no programmer and more that the english from school and what I have learned for understanding daggerfall with my old english - german wordbook is hard for me to understand).

Thank you for that and for the Daggerfall questions you have also answered from me before.

--Daggerfall is the best game what was ever made! (talk) 14:50, 16 March 2015 (GMT)

No problem. And besides, all books in Daggerfall are basically in some sort of ASCII-text, so any text-editor will be sufficient to view them.--PLRDLF (talk) 20:37, 21 March 2015 (GMT)

Daggerfall Helseth quest[edit]

Thanks for clearing that up, it would explain why there was no text in the resource files that would go there. Could have sworn a courier approached at that point on a previous playthrough (which was why I added it), but that could have been for anything. I just hope the rest is accurate. Echo (talk) 03:16, 14 August 2016 (UTC)

Howdy from uniblab[edit]

'Sup, homes? -- Uniblab (talk) 03:40, 8 January 2017 (UTC)